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03/20/03 0:00 |
Mark Meyer |
I have always been fascinated with Northern Pacific's line from
Manitoba Jct. to Winnipeg and wonder if anyone can
offer some insight into its
operations. I have found very
little written about this line.
The line appears to be NP's longest branch. It also has the
distinction of the having the NP's
last RDC passenger service, and had the last NP passenger service
discontinued prior to those discontinued with the start of Amtrak. Overall the line was pretty much a
single route, except between Fertile and
Carthage Junction there were two routes (the original via Red Lake
Falls Jct. and the shorter route via Crookston). The
Red Lake Falls route featured a short branch from Red Lake Falls Jct. to
Red Lake Falls and from Key West
to Sherack. When the railroads began publishing
their freight schedules in the 1960s,
NP showed one freight train
each way on this route. Interestingly, depending on the year, the
westbound train shows a time at Crookston, but the eastbound does not. I am curious as to whether
perhaps the through freight on the
line used one route in one
direction and other in the opposite direction. Or, was there a local
based in this area to serve these branches? Or perhaps was there local service in addition to this
through freight train? If so,
where was it and the crews
based? Did the through train operate east or west from Manitoba Jct.?
In other words, did it go to Staples or just go to the large
yard in nearby Dilworth? Did NP freight crews run to Winnipeg, or just
to Pembina or Emerson Jct.? With regard to passenger service on
the line in the 1960s, how did crews
run on this route? According
to John Strauss's book (NP Pictorial 5) the RDC on this route (which
actually operated between Fargo and Winnipeg originally) continued between Fargo and the Canadian
Border until May 24, 1969. Was there
a time when the train did operate only to Pembina? When the Mainstreeter was speeded up in the fall of 1968,
the schedule of the Winnipeg RDC also changed southbound
(likely timetable east). Instead of
leaving Winnipeg in the morning and connecting with the Mainstreeter
in Hawley that afternoon, train 14
departed Winnipeg at 450 PM and arrived in
Fargo at 1210 AM, offering a 2 plus hour connection to the eastbound
North Coast Limited. However, the
northbound train's schedule didn't change,
arriving in Winnipeg about 830 PM, and met train 14 at the
US-Canada border. The schedule change and long layover (in
the middle of the night) at Fargo
certainly hurt patronage. Does anyone know why the southbound
train wasn't, for instance, changed to depart Winnipeg
at 1150 PM instead of 450 PM?
This would have allowed NP to
use the same RDC inbound on train 13 to protect train 14 that evening, instead of having the equipment layover
in Winnipeg over 20 hours per trip.
This would also have allowed for a 710 AM arrival in Fargo, and a
similar (in layover time) connection with the Mainstreeter. By
the time of the schedule change, of course, I suppose it was a
foregone conclusion that the
Winnipeg trains would not operate much
longer . .perhaps
that the was goal, but does seem to be a poor waste of equipment .
.unless it had something to do with the fact that
trains 13 and 14 then met at the
border (both trains at Emerson Jct. about 645 PM). Did this have some
kind of advantage, perhaps if there
were different crews on either side of the
border? Does anyone know? Also, does anyone know why these trains had
the longest life of any of the NP
RDC runs? Thanks for any insight.
RDC Amtrak Red lake Falls Train 13 Train 14
Fertile Carthage Junction Staples Passenger 1960s Fargo schedules Compiler
C Frissell |
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03/24/03 10:04 |
Dennis Miller |
The line you refer to
brings back so many memories of my growing up in the 50's in East Grand Forks. My dad worked
for the NP as a switchman for 20 years,
and my Grandfather was a bridge builder, and finally the superintendent out of Staples, an NP
employee for 40 years until his passing
in 63. My dad is currently on vacation, but when he returns I will ask
him for the details, and pass them
along. Manitoba Junction Red Lake
Falls Compiler C Frissell |
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03/24/03 10:30 |
Mark Meyer |
In a message dated
3/24/2003 11:06:57 AM Central Standard Time,
d50mil@h... writes: >
Greetings, > The line you refer to brings back so many memories of my
growing up in the > 50's in East
Grand Forks. My dad worked for the NP as a switchman for 20 > years, and my Grandfather was a
bridge builder, and finally the >
superintendent out of Staples, an NP employee for 40 years until his > passing > in 63. > My dad is currently on vacation, but when he
returns I will ask him for the
> > details, and pass
them along. > Until then, > Dennis > Thanks, Dennis. And with the recent discussion about Rail
Diesel Cars, I wonder if trains 13
and 14 on this line, usually operating with a single RDC, encountered any problems in the winter.
These "cars" aren't very heavy, and I wonder about their ability to break hardened snow drifts,
especially on a line where there was
probably only one other train per day, and given the likelihood that it could be many hours
without a train to keep the line
relatively clear. I know that even today, Amtrak's Empire Builder
performs a lot of "drift
busting" in this area, especially west of Grand Forks, where it is sometimes the only train that uses that
line during a given day. But this is
a train with multiple locomotives and 10 or more cars. Knowing how hard the drifts can get in this area, makes me
wonder how a lone RDC might fare.
Even today, BNSF requires trains in this area to have two locomotives....not for power necessarily, but for two sources
of heat in case one of the units
fails. Of course, 40 years ago, there were a lot more maintenance of
way personnel than you see today to
keep the line open, but the NP Winnipeg line
was basically a branch that had a passenger train. RDC BNSF Amtrak snow Train 13 Train
14 Compiler C Frissell |
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05/17/03 18:04 |
Dennis Miller |
Well my Dad returned from
vacation, and was quite impressed someone other than myself was interested in the branch line he worked on for
so many years. I will quote him
verbatim, as, quite frankly, I had to look up some of the towns. " Train 752 originated in Lake
Park. Then to Manitoba Junction,no stop here. There was switch control to take us off the main line on to the
branch. Next stop Hitterdal, unless
it was a tonnage train, no stop then, as it was uphill, and the steam engine did not have enough power to stop
and start. Next stop Syre, the Twin
Valley. On to Fertile, Crookston, and East Grand Forks. Done here. Changed crews and caboose. North end. To
Mekinok, ND., grain elevator only, although the branch to the AFB
started here. On to Gilby, then
Forest River. Next to Voss and Grafton. (side note, my brother has a wall clock
that my dad salvaged from the fire in
48-49 at the Grafton station, quite a nice item) Onward to Drayton,MN, then
Bowesmont and Pembina. Go through customs, and deliver the train in Emerson Junction." Dad also stated
after delivering the train, they had to layover until the engineer was able to head back. They slept
in the caboose. It did have a wood/coal stove, but no running water, or
facilities. In the winter at temps of 40-50 below zero, it was quite an
experience when you had to exit for
natures call. One final note, Dad said there is probably less than ten men
alive today who worked on that
line. rain 752 Compiler C Frissell |